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Baltar: What ultimately motivates him?
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Senmut
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PostPosted: Sat Aug 19, 2006 7:04 am    Post subject: Baltar: What ultimately motivates him? Reply with quote

Simple question. What do you see, beneath everything, as the root motivating factor in Baltar's life?
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LZaza



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PostPosted: Sat Aug 19, 2006 2:40 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Ego.
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Senmut
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PostPosted: Sun Aug 20, 2006 7:02 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Succint, if brief. Wink
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MAD
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PostPosted: Wed Aug 23, 2006 12:07 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Survival
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MAD
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PostPosted: Wed Aug 23, 2006 12:17 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

How about a couple of the Deadly Sins:

Pride is excessive belief in one's own abilities, that interferes with the individual's recognition of the grace of God. It has been called the sin from which all others arise. Pride is also known as Vanity.

Envy is the desire for others' traits, status, abilities, or situation.

Anger is manifested in the individual who spurns love and opts instead for fury. It is also known as Wrath.

Greed is the desire for material wealth or gain, ignoring the realm of the spiritual. It is also called Avarice or Covetousness.

and maybe even (at least the physical work that is):

Sloth is the avoidance of physical or spiritual work.



When we continue on these...

Gluttony is an inordinate desire to consume more than that which one requires.

Does he ever eat? Is there a Cylon that cooks for him?

Lust is an inordinate craving for the pleasures of the body.

Something he's really missing among the toasters (maybe that's why Baltar in New Galactica has to catch up!)
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Last edited by MAD on Mon Aug 28, 2006 10:32 am; edited 1 time in total
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Senmut
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PostPosted: Fri Aug 25, 2006 6:53 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

THAT should keep Baltar in Confession for a good while! Wink
Interesting answer.
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mikedx
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PostPosted: Fri Aug 25, 2006 1:28 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

I think at first it was survival, but once he takes care of that then he tries to gain power in whatever situation he's in. Whether it's humans or cylons.

All about power...
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LZaza



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PostPosted: Fri Aug 25, 2006 2:51 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

mikedx wrote:
I think at first it was survival, but once he takes care of that then he tries to gain power in whatever situation he's in. Whether it's humans or cylons.

All about power...


I was thinking about your 'survival' answer, but at first --when he first consciously decided to betray his people--he would have been safe as anyone else on the Twelve Worlds so survival wouldn't have entered into it. It wouldn't have been until he was on his knees with a Cylon sword behind his neck that it would have entered the quotient.

So, he was getting something else out of betrayal. Perhaps he saw himself as "Imperious Leader" of Piscon when the smoke cleared, so ego and power (as you said) were more likely the motivators there. Also, I think that Baltar is a bit of a nutter, which made him so entirely enjoyable when he'd fall into Adama's or Cain's military traps because of his need to crush Adama or because of his fear in a given moment.
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Senmut
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PostPosted: Sat Aug 26, 2006 5:42 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Very good. I also saws a thread of personal animus towards Adama. Something very deep-rooted in Baltar's psyche. Some sort of personal demon. Anyone else catch that?
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mikedx
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PostPosted: Sun Aug 27, 2006 3:16 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Quote:
It wouldn't have been until he was on his knees with a Cylon sword behind his neck that it would have entered the quotient.


Oh no, I wasn't thinking of survival when it came to the betrayal. I was thinking it when like you said he was on his knees with the cylons, and when he was trapped in the tombs on Kobol.

The only reason he survived was that he promised that he could defeat the Galactica. He seemed to be power hungry once they gave him some stature with the cylons, so he didn't seem to care whether it was humans or cylons that he ruled over.

But then again, what happened with the War of the Gods when he surrendered to the Galactica? He was trying to save his butt.
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LZaza



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PostPosted: Sun Aug 27, 2006 4:48 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

mikedx wrote:




But then again, what happened with the War of the Gods when he surrendered to the Galactica? He was trying to save his butt.


Was he trying to save his butt? Or was Iblis somehow influencing his spurious decision? This is one of those Ships of Lights vrs Iblis things that they left a little on the vague side, leaving it open to the individual's interpretation.

Don't get me wrong, I kind of like it that way. It can make great fodder for thought, especially in fan fiction. Very Happy
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MAD
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PostPosted: Mon Aug 28, 2006 10:45 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

As I answered with my Dealy Sins, I think there's a combination of things that make Baltar tick. Certainly "Envy" of Adama and the position he has. He uses an old fool (Adar) to get the one thing he doesn't have yet: full power! So also "Greed" (for power, wealth, etc.) is something that describes Baltar very well.
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LZaza



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PostPosted: Mon Aug 28, 2006 5:58 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

I was more specifically wondering what people believe about Baltar's delivery to the Fleet. Was it of Baltar's "own free will", as he insisted, or did Count Iblis influence him?
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Senmut
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PostPosted: Sat Oct 14, 2006 6:19 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Apollo said that Iblis only had power over those who freely gave themselves to him. Baltar had willingly given himself over to evil. He wasn't tricked into it, or just caught up in events. Hence, Iblis had more power over his mind and thoughts than those of the others.
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epaddon



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PostPosted: Sat Oct 14, 2006 6:59 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Hard to say really. The "free will" aspect could be manipulated by Iblis to his own purposes if he has foreknowledge that this is how Baltar will recat to the SOL displays. A nice demonstration of the difference between omniscence and omnipotence.
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